“We are in a different mindset than our clients are. Even that is a barrier because, at that point, we don’t see the context where our client comes from.”  This week’s TLC podcast features trial lawyer Pat Montes, who offers a thought-provoking look at how language and culture impact a lawyer’s relationships with their clients. Bringing to the table her unique perspective as a bilingual and bicultural attorney, Pat stresses the importance of working with clients in their native language rather than forcing them to struggle to convey their authentic story in English.  As Pat and host Rafe Foreman continue their discussion, they raise a new set of questions: How can a client relate to their lawyer when they come from entirely different backgrounds? And how can a lawyer discover their client’s story when their cultural differences, despite both speaking English, effectively mean they’re speaking different languages? The answers to these questions and more are explored in-depth in this engaging podcast episode. Listen along as Pat and Rafe provide necessary insight into connecting with a diverse set of clients and ensuring equal justice for all.

The Trial Lawyers College Podcast

Pat Montes on Language & Culture in Attorney-Client Relationships

“There are people who do bad things, but I’ve never met anybody who I felt was just a bad person.” Continuing our series on ‘Reconstructing Success,’ California Public Defender Emily Fisher explores the ways that trial lawyers can intentionally improve injustices and inefficiencies in the justice system. As she guides listeners through her blueprint to resolving these systemic issues, Emily provides a thought-provoking starting point for the empathic trial lawyer to fine-tune their advocacy for their clients and bring humanity back into the courtroom.

Emily Fisher’s Five Steps to Reconstructing Success in the Justice System

“When we tell good stories, the listeners engage.” This week, host Rafe Foreman meets with accomplished civil trial lawyer Scott Glovsky to explore his methods of successfully conveying the emotion behind his clients’ stories to the jury. A passionate advocate for individuals who’ve faced unjust denials by their health insurance companies, Scott delves into the intersection between the struggles of his clients and the motivations of their insurers.  As the episode comes to a close, Rafe and Scott encourage listeners to think about the underlying emotional connection that their story is conveying. Is it adequate? Is it complete? Is it thorough? These are all essential questions a trial lawyer must ask themselves to ensure that they can lead the jury to find justice for their clients.

Scott Glovsky on Effective Storytelling

“There are so many people who have incredible talents that are going to waste because they’ve been excluded. It’s not hard to find if you just open your eyes….and when we see it, we need to use our position of power and privilege in the groups and organizations that we’re leading to elevate that talent and allow them to have the space to shine.” This week, trial lawyer and legal educator Keeley Blanchard joins Rafe Foreman in an integral discussion on the importance of inclusion, diversity, and representation in the legal profession.  As a trainer of public defenders, Keeley explains how valuable it can be for members of underserved communities to see and be taught by legal leaders who share a key part of their identity, whether that’s their race, disability, gender, or sexual orientation. However, Keeley reminds listeners of the barriers that currently limit that from happening at the frequency that it should, prompting her to explore the solutions to this pressing issue.  As Rafe and Keeley dissect this issue from the perspective of their own marginalized identities as well as their points of privilege, they encourage legal professionals and leaders to identify the biases they have within themselves and to do the work to overcome them in order to provide a safe and welcoming space for all.

Keeley Blanchard on Inclusivity in the Legal Community

John Sloan hosts the TLC Podcast this week to interview Rafe Foreman and partner attorney Susan Hutchison on the incredible verdict the two trial lawyers won in a groundbreaking and unconventional gender discrimination case.  Listen along as Rafe and Susan describe how they successfully conveyed their 72-year-old client’s story to the jury after a false sexual assault accusation led to him losing his 20-year job with an HVAC company. In a compelling episode led by a dynamic group of voices that TLC students have come to know and love over the years, John leads Rafe and Susan as they provide a powerful testament to the efficacy of the psychodramatic methods and the value of truly reaching one’s client to discover the winning story.

Rafe Foreman and Susan Hutchison’s Incredible Gender Discrimination Verdict, Hosted by John Sloan

“Everything I need to know I learned in psychodrama. I remind myself to listen with my heart, tune into the emotions -- not just the words -- be open, be honest, and be kind because we have more in common than we’ll ever know...and to be fearless because no matter how alone we’re feeling, we are never alone and our TLC group -- every single one of them -- will be there to help you when you’re going through a problem.” This week, host Rafe Foreman is joined by Connie Taylor Henderson, who practices law with her husband and her son in Vancouver, Washington. Continuing our current podcast series titled “Restructuring Success,” Connie backpacks off of the upcoming Warrior Magazine theme with an engaging dive into why TLC is worth fighting for.  By sharing the impact that TLC has had on her life both personally and professionally and reflecting on TLC’s past, present, and future in these turbulent yet promising times, Connie’s words are sure to resonate with all who have been touched by the TLC methods.

Why TLC Is Worth Fighting For With Connie Taylor Henderson

“Do something to make someone else’s day better. If we all do that, every day, we’ll change the world.” This week, Washington attorney Mark Wagner continues our ‘Restructuring Success’ series with a refreshing take on the true meaning of success. Channeling the core message of the Trial Lawyers College, Mark argues that success is all in how we treat others. Through engaging storytelling and a matter-of-fact method of expression, Mark reminds listeners of the humanity in all of us and that we are more alike than we are different.

Mark Wagner on Loving Others

“Success is really subjective, and I think that’s okay. The only thing that I need to do to live truthfully is to define the things that are important to me and let the rest burn. What’s scarier -- disappointing people or thinking, at the end of the day, what kind of life could I have had if I had just been a little bit braver?” This week, Ilinois criminal defense attorney Cambry McNabb joins host Rafe Foreman to explore the true meaning of success. As a young lawyer who attended the Trial Lawyers College early in her career, Cambry has had her fair share of successes, but not all of those successes had perfect outcomes. Discussing the most noteworthy trials and tribulations of her legal practice, Cambry treats listeners to a thought-provoking dive into what it means to win or lose a case.

Redefining Success With Cambry McNabb

“The storytelling potential in this case was off the charts because of the lengths the defense was going to go to to avoid the truth.” In this podcast, Eric Fong joins host Rafe Foreman to share, in captivating detail, the extraordinary story of how he and his client defied all odds to obtain a $91 million verdict in a recent personal injury trial.  The case began when Eric’s client suffered a significant, life-altering brain injury during a late-night convenience store robbery that arose from inadequate security. Incredibly moved by his client’s struggles and humanity, Eric was faced with the responsibility to convey those same feelings to the jury.  Now recalling those moments for Rafe and his listeners, Eric discusses the astronomical challenges he and his client encountered throughout the trial, from COVID restrictions to juror predispositions, and the techniques they used to overcome them. Above all, Eric explores how he got the jury to not only hate the defendant but to love his client exactly as he did. 

Eric Fong on the Remarkable $91 Million Verdict Won for His Injured Client

“Always be willing to be flexible -- don’t get so married to your methodologies that you can’t change those, too. It is in preparation and hard work but it’s also in willing to be open to the ideas of others.” This week, Todd Kelly of Austin, Texas, joins host Rafe Foreman to kick off our new podcast series titled ‘Reconstructing Success’ with an engaging overview of the importance of preparation and planning as a trial lawyer, particularly in the scope of pretrial. In discussing the strategies applied to some of his most recent trials, Todd explores the ideal balance between flexibility and consistency and the value of varying one’s approach to win justice for their clients. 

Todd Kelly on Planning in Pretrial

“For me, getting this opportunity with this scholarship, the biggest thing is spreading the message to go and get the vaccine.”   On this week’s podcast, high school freshman Jack Lucchesi and his mother, Bridget Lucchesi, join host Rafe Foreman. Jack is one of the first ten winners selected in New York State's College Scholarship raffle for vaccinated teens, and his mom Bridget is a clinical mental health therapist who has deep Trial Lawyers College connections. In addition to knowing Rafe since childhood, Bridget joined TLC for the Death Penalty seminar in 2010, and she studied with Zerka Moreno, wife of Jacob Levy Moreno, the inventor of psychodrama!    Rafe, Jack, and Bridget cover a variety of COVID-19-related topics during their conversation including Jack’s scholarship raffle win, how to combat and identify misinformation, how to deal with grief throughout the pandemic, and much more.

Jack Lucchesi and Bridget Lucchesi on the COVID Vaccine, Access to Education, and Coping with the Challenges of the Pandemic

“I decided that I should do something I don’t normally do, and that’s reverse roles with a defense attorney and try to figure out where they’re coming from and how their lives have changed. So, I was trying to get personally involved with defense attorneys, not just in the case but in their actual lives...”   On this week’s podcast, Conroe, TX trial attorney and TLC faculty member Paula Estefan joins host Rafe Foreman to discuss how she works with opposing counsel, the benefits of doing so, and how her approach to opposing counsel has changed over time. Through their conversation, Paula and Rafe also touch on the power of silence and listening, what endures about TLC’s methods, and the deep connections formed at the Trial Lawyers College.

Paula Estefan on Working with Opposing Counsel and What Matters about TLC

“The plaintiff’s practice can be very lonely. I think that loneliness has been a bit amplified by being inside, cooped up, and not able to communicate and build relationships like we were meant to. The pandemic has caused an amplification of those relationships gone silent.” On this week’s podcast, Kansas City trial attorney Brian McCallister joins host Rafe Foreman to discuss the ways that the lingering effects of the COVID-19 pandemic and other events of the past year will impact the practice of law in the future. As he guides listeners through the cases that have been impacted by this new era in his own practice of trial law and those of his colleagues, Brian provides a stark illustration of the fragility of the jury trial and the importance of human connection.

Brian McCallister on the Post-Pandemic Law Practice

“Judges are just like us -- they’re egocentric, they think with their own minds, they speak with their own heart, and they bring a lifetime of experiences as a human and as a previous lawyer to the bench.” This riveting podcast features former Oklahoma judge Kenny Adair, now a criminal and civil trial lawyer, who gives his unique perspective on the fears and vulnerabilities of the more challenging judges encountered by trial lawyers. Sharing invaluable insight into the human side of the men and women behind the bench, Kenny presents listeners with a refreshing take on the use of psychodrama to connect with the judge and win justice for their clients. 

Kenny Adair on the Inner Workings of the Trial Judge

“I’m one of those types of people that wants to be all things all the time, and what I’m learning is you can’t be all things all the time. It’s just not possible. That’s how you wind up burned out and really of no use to anybody.” Continuing our theme of ‘Managing in Tough Times’ is Kahlie Hoffman, a Kansas City-based personal injury trial lawyer who’s raising two young boys behind the scenes. Despite the difficulties her busy life has handed her, particularly during the COVID-19 pandemic, Kahlie believes that each role she plays strengthens her abilities in the other. Reflecting on the challenges and triumphs she has faced while managing both full-time roles, Kahlie provides invaluable insight into the value of self-care, setting realistic boundaries for oneself, and communicating those boundaries to others.

Kahlie Hoffman on Balancing the Roles of Mother & Trial Lawyer

The Trial Lawyers College Podcast talks to leading attorneys, TLC board members, and faculty about the ideas and the issues that are affecting trial lawyers today. The TLC podcast covers courtroom strategy, communicating with jurors, connecting with clients, methods that drive success, balancing healthy relationships with a busy practice and more.

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The Trial Lawyers College Podcast

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